Does SpyBot S&D affect W10's Windows Defender?

[iKerry]

Just uninstalled SSD and Windows Defender automatically turned itself on.

Kerry

[drghughes]

Just found the same thing. Windows Defender was off and couldn't be started. I tried updating Spybot to v2.5 using the updater on the desktop, and there was no change. After removing Spybot, Windows Defender is working again.

Details:
Windows 10 Build 10162
Problem was initially with Spybot v2.4, but also with v2.5, both free versions

[PepiMK]

There's some automatic on and off for Defender initiated by Action Center. I'll try to find more details about that asap.

[drghughes]

Note that uninstalling Spybot v2.5 doesn't uninstall the startup entry "Makes sure Spybot 2 is there on Windows 10".

[PepiMK]

That entry will become passive after five reboots (there's a counter in the registry for that), but we indeed could not make it uninstallable, otherwise it would conflict with our survival solution in some scenarios.
Maybe we can check if we can make it self destruct instead of getting passive...

edit: how exactly do you try to start/activate/enable Windows Defender? Haven't found anything so far, seems contrary to previous versions of Windows that reported multiple active AV/AS, 10 will only accept one?

[drghughes]

When Windows Defender isn't running you should be able to restart it in Control Panel under System and Security, then Security and Maintenance, i.e.

Screenshot 2015-07-30 00.59.35.png

Obviously, since I've uninstalled Spybot, you can't see it here, but that's where it will be.

Regarding the "Makes sure Spybot 2 is there on Windows 10" entry, it's pretty aggressive as is since what appears is the UAC popup asking whether I want to run it. You need to give it some more context, rather than just dumping users into the install process.

[PepiMK]

It's not there in Action Center, since MS seem to have changed the Action Center behaviour to list only one application.
Even though we started months before the Windows 10 release to contact and ask Microsoft, the WSC/AC team in special, we didn't receive the WSC software vendor documentation until July 27th.
Anyway, to reproduce, I probably would need the exact steps you've taken. IF you're sure you were able to try to re-enable Windows Defender in Action Center, we'll have another look.

A UAC popup? Actually, test.exe is there specially to avoid UAC, which would only appear when the installer needs to run. test.exe simply checks for the proper circumstances (Windows 10, no Spybot installed, no previous attempt), and launches the UAC part only when necessary.

Microsoft actually suggests a very similar way (as "aggressive"), possibly with even less user interaction, for installation of new versions after the upgrade.

[drghughes]

Anyway, to reproduce, I probably would need the exact steps you've taken. IF you're sure you were able to try to re-enable Windows Defender in Action Center, we'll have another look.

I think that there is some confusion here. No one, as far as I can see in this thread, has reported being able to enable Windows Defender with Spybot running.

However, when Spybot is blocking Windows Defender and you try and fix it, e.g. by following the warning in the notifications, you get taken to the Control Panel section I showed you, and Windows Defender is shown as not started with a button that you should be able to click to restart it.

A UAC popup? Actually, test.exe is there specially to avoid UAC, which would only appear when the installer needs to run. test.exe simply checks for the proper circumstances (Windows 10, no Spybot installed, no previous attempt), and launches the UAC part only when necessary.

Microsoft actually suggests a very similar way (as "aggressive"), possibly with even less user interaction, for installation of new versions after the upgrade.

Exactly. I'd uninstalled Spybot, and then when I restart I get this message trying to reinstall it.

Anyhow, I've given you the feedback - I think that you could do better by introducing a step that asks whether the user wants to reinstall Spybot, rather than assuming that it has been removed by the Windows 10 upgrade process.

[drghughes]

This isn't fixed in build 10240.

And here is the screenshot to prove it:

Screenshot 2015-07-31 17.42.33.png

Clicking on the <Turn on now> button does nothing.

[PepiMK]

Thanks, that screenshot clarifies some things. I can reproduce this now, looks to be an issue in Defender though. Nothing in the event log. Maybe defender can only serve both at once, not just one?