View Full Version : IE7 and Outlook HTML e-mail create is slow
Using XP-SP2, IE7, Outlook 2003 and the HTML format, there is a significant typing delay creating new e-mail messages, both using stationary and not. Using text or rich text, there is no lag. Also, IE7 in general seemed slower.
I have eliminated anti-spyware and ant-virus as a cause. Office Detect and Repair did not fix anything.
Resetting IE7 fixes the problem.
Control Panel>Internet Options>Advanced>Restore>Reset.
Caution: this resets the IE7 add-ins also, which must be investigated and re-enabled as necessary.
Open IE7>Tools>Manage Add-ons>Enable or Disable add-ons.
I have traced the issue down to SpyBot Immunization and Spyware Blaster Enabling Protection for Restricted Sites. Either one causes the problem. This is repeatable. The problem started around 1/20/07.
In addition, I have found that Sun Microsystems BHO (ssv.dll) slows IE7.
Disable SSV Helper class - (It's from Sun Microsystems) It's a BHO - ssv.dll
Close browser and then re-open.
Cheers
rwinegar
2007-03-26, 01:35
I am surprised this message received no attention. I just stumbled into it doing Google searches trying to fix my wrecked Outlook HTML email. I immunized with Spybot yesterday. That's when my problem started. I just undid the immunization and now Outlook HTML works good again.
There is a serious problem here that needs to be fixed. I feel much safer with immunization running. But not at the expense of wrecking my email.
Can this be fixed and is any attention being afforded to such a fix?
Spybotnorma
2007-03-26, 14:16
Some users e-mailed us that they have experienced compatibility problems with the Internet Explorer 7 and Spybot - Search & Destroy.
In detail, there were problems with freezing/not responding of our software and also problems with the SDhelper of Spybot - Search & Destroy that won't work correctly.
Currently, we are working on this issue and try to find out what the problem might be.
We hope that we will solve this problem very soon.
There will be a new SDHelper.
Please be patient.
Further, you will find more infos and other users' experiences regarding this point in our forum:
http://forums.spybot.info/showthread.php?p=48286#post48286
http://forums.spybot.info/showthread.php?t=8492
rwinegar
2007-03-27, 13:49
I had no problem with IE7 so long as I had the browser helper disabled. But that did not prevent problems with Outlook 2003. Typing was delayed. Sometimes I would type 5 or 6 letters and nothing would appear on the monitor. Then suddenly all the letters would appear at once. Repeating was would not work. If I held any letter key down it would not repeat. One letter only would appear until I removed my finger from the key - then multiple images of the letter would appear. I can turn this behavior on/off by disabling/reenabling the immunization feature of Spybot.
I believe this behavior was brought to Spybot's attention with the release of IE7 almost six months ago. How patient do you expect user's to be?
majicmountain
2007-04-03, 17:48
I have the same problem as well as logging out of hotmail. This freezes and eventually times out. A fix or resolution would be greatly appreciated.
majicmountain
2007-04-03, 17:51
I wonder if it's something to do with the phishing filter?
Using XP-SP2, IE7, Outlook 2003 and the HTML format, there is a significant typing delay creating new e-mail messages, both using stationary and not. Using text or rich text, there is no lag.
<snip>
I have traced the issue down to SpyBot Immunization and Spyware Blaster Enabling Protection for Restricted Sites. Either one causes the problem. This is repeatable. The problem started around 1/20/07.I had the identical problem. Thank you for your post, as it helped me find this fix: In Outlook go to Tools/Options/Security/Security Zones, change from "Restricted Sites" to "Internet".
I suppose this means Outlook will possibly download from blocked sites should I happen to come across one in e-mail. I will have to live with this risk, which I suspect will be small considering I have multiple spam filters and other protections in place.
MS Outlook help says:
Zone list box— Specify the zone you want to apply to HTML messages. Zones can warn you of potential dangers or can prevent scripts and other processes from running when you open HTML messages. To change the settings associated with each zone, click Zone Settings.
RonaldReagan
2007-04-23, 12:30
Hey Everyone!
Looks like we are the only people on the earth who know about this problem, and that's a shame because it really stinks! Anyway, after reading through the posts I was definitely able to apply the work-around fix of unimmunizing my system, but that to me was unacceptable, so I have been pounding away at this in my spare time.
Okay, I still do not know how to permanently apply a fix for this, but I DEFINITELY know why your typing/e-mail create/e-mail open is so slow. Of course, the amount of slowdown will vary per-machine, but that is irrelevant.
I decided to run a process viewer on my machine, and I was amazed to discover that with Immunization enabled, Outlook was literally scanning each and every single blocked domain that Spybot had added to the Security Zones every time I opened an e-mail or even typed a letter. Yes, each time I pressed "A" on my keyboard, my CPU was running through all 13,000+ entries in the registry's Zonemaps. In fact, anything that had to do with HTML text editing was causing this. Opening a HTML-formatted e-mail, typing HTML-formatted text, or even highlighting said text would all result in my CPU having to run a marathon. The more you type, the more gets added to the CPU's work queue, and you can see where the progressive slowdown comes from. With Immunization turned off (i.e. all bad domains removed from the Zonemaps section of my registry), not only does Outlook work flawlessly, but what's most peculiar is that unlike before it doesn't even try to scan the Zonemaps.
So, long story short:
Immunization turned on = CPU makes 13,000+ queries to your registry.
Immunization turned off = CPU takes a breather and doesn't even check.
You get the point... :eek:
It would make a lot more sense if during the latter, the CPU did check the registry, but because the list was either non-existent or short, everything moved smoother. However, since it is not like this, I would have to assume that there is either some setting in Outlook that can be changed, or that Spybot (or the kind folks that code and operate it) could hold the secret.
Is there a secret setting or registry entry?
Is there a particular Zonemap that should be changed?
Is there some control somewhere else in Windows that can be modified?
These are the questions that I pose to the readers and to the forum masters. One thing is for certain, this is a very real and very annoying problem!
========================================================
BTW: Since this problem seems isolated to this message board, perhaps we can start by trying to find some similarities between our software/hardware setups. Obviously, I know for a fact that the main issue here is with the addition of IE7, but because it is so closely integrated with Outlook (when viewing messages in HTML mode), I figured it wouldn't hurt to also see if we could spot some additional similarities to help narrow down the cause of the problem.
My Specs:
-Hardware-
AMD Athlon 64 3500+
2GB RAM
2x 250 GB HDs
ATI Radeon x3100 w/512MB DRAM
-Software-
Windows XP Media Center Edition (AKA: Win XP Pro SP2)
Microsoft Office 2003 (Includes Outlook)
Norton's AntiVirus 2006 w/Office Scanning Turned On
Internet Explorer 7 (Primary Browser)
Firefox 2.0
Netscape Browser 8.0
========================================================
Good hunting, folks! Let's win one for the Gipper...
-Ronald Reagan
I too was having very slow typing echo from my Outlook 2003. This was only when in HTML format, no problem with raw text. After reading your comments I fully removed both SpyBot and Spyware Blaster. Now it seems much better, only minor spirts of backed up letters. It seems like my IE is also running better. Was getting long "waiting for ..." in bottom box (normal shows "done").
Still need to test more but 1st impression is good.
OK, my Outlook seems to be working OK. IE7 is still very slow.
RonaldReagan
2007-05-05, 11:17
Hello Again Everyone!
After doing some more investigation into the matter of the typing delay caused by Spybot immunizations, I have discovered that there is yet another work-around solution. This work-around will enable any user to have both immunizations installed, as well as a speedy and functional HTML-based Outlook.
The Steps:
Start Outlook
In the Menu Bar go to Tools/Options
Click the "Security" tab
Under the "Security Zones" section click on the pull-down menu
Change the default (should be "Restricted sites") to "Internet Sites"
Change this value back to the default ("Restricted sites")
Click OK
Voila, Outlook should work correctly again until its next reboot. Of course, you will have to repeat these steps each time that you start the program, but until there is a more permanent fix in place it will have to do. :sad:
Clearly, the issue here is with Security Zones, as with my previous post I outlined how with immunizations installed Outlook is querying the registry for every single entry in the Zone Maps. Now, whether this is a bug in Outlook's behavior or perhaps a technical snafu on behalf of the immunization database is still unknown, but it is evident that the problem resides here. Of course, this behavior is perplexing, because as some of you may have noticed that on its own, Outlook will sometimes (although rarely) not suffer from the slowdown.
Through my efforts, I am still trying to pinpoint the exact registry entry that may be causing Outlook to misbehave with regards to the Security Zones, but as it stands it is definitely a combination of Outlook 2003, Spybot Immunizations, and IE7.
Hopefully, Team Spybot will be able to shed some light on this subject, as this is practically the only message board on the entire internet that has so accurately and effectively narrowed down the cause of this problem.
The hunt continues, so good luck!
-Ronald Reagan
Although I don't know for sure I don't think this is a Spybot issue. I think it is between IE7 and Outlook alone. I've tried the suggestions in this post and they sort of work. "Undo"ing immunization caused Outlook to crash. Turning it back on fixed that problem. Changing the security settings makes things fine until Outlook is shut down and then restarted. In fact you can make other changes in the Options setting and this problem will go away until you restart Outlook again. Turning SDHelper off made no difference.
Others on the Internet have reported this same html issue with no mention of Spybot. See the Microsoft forums for several reports people with this same problem. Some people have reported other "solutions" - disabling Outlook add-ins, changing language options. All hit and miss with results.
I don't want to rain on your parade but changing Spybot and/or security settings doesn't do it here.
We're simplying using text format and waiting for Microsoft to push out a fix in one of their automatic updates at some point in the future.
Cheers.
RonaldReagan
2007-05-06, 03:14
Hello Again,
Although I agree that ultimately the fix will probably rest with MS, I would still have to disagree with your point that Spybot has nothing to do with it. It clearly does, as the difference between immunization and no immunization equals Outlook scanning the Zone Maps section of the registry.
With this in mind, I think it would be beneficial for both Team Spybot and for MS if they (or we) could track down the exact entry/entries in the registry that trigger this behavior. On machines that suffer from this specific problem, it is evident that removing immunization (hence, blanking out the Zone Maps) will relieve this problem 100% of the time.
As for what other users may or may not be experiencing, that is still up in the air. I am convinced that what many people are encountering is unrelated to this specific issue, and is in fact a result of other problems such as poorly configured machines, malware, or etc. Crashes or slowdowns in IE7 are not the same problems as the slow e-mail/text create.
Until this specific issue is addressed by a specific entry on the MS website with a hotfix, I will continue attempting to narrow down the list of immunizations. :red:
Good Luck,
-Ronald Reagan
You are both correct to some extent, since under certain circumstances the Restricted Sites entries can interact in undesired ways in combination with IE and other applications, generally security applications in most cases.
The4Bs is correct that this isn't really a Spybot S&D issue, since all Spybot really does is add a number of entries to that list, it's Internet Explorer and apparently Outlook that actually check the list during their operation. There are other programs including SpywareBlaster that also place even more entries in that list, so it isn't really an issue for Team Spybot to solve.
Microsoft has taken the stance in the past that automatically filling the Restricted Sites list with thousands of entries isn't what was intended, since it was really designed for the user to add their own sites manually one at a time. Though in theory the idea works, eventually even the most stable system will start to show the effects of needing to scan through thousands of entries for each web site accessed. You are likely seeing these effects, possibly in relation to another security application on your system that is also attempting to verify each access like a Phishing filter or AV/AS product.
Since many combinations of this issue are being seen it's likely there are at least several different combinations of applications that can cause it. Since Spybot simply places entries in the list, it really isn't actively involved, though I believe that TeaTimer Resident monitors this registry area for changes, so you might try disabling that during your testing if you have it running.
Unfortunately the interaction of active security applications is becoming more common as they each add more monitoring of registry and other changes. Since Internet Explorer 7 and Outlook have also added some of their own protection, the likelyhood of these issues is increasing, often leaving the users to discover the interactions themselves. Good luck in the search for yours.
Bitman
RonaldReagan
2007-05-07, 09:33
Hello Bitman, (Hopefully, 8-bit!)
You put up an interesting post, and it's given me some food for thought. However, I would have to point out a few differenced between what I think are the two main problems that people are experiencing.
===================================================
(Problem 1, Outlook Slowdown)
I can tell you with absolute certainty that the problem is indeed caused by Outlook scanning the Zone Maps. However, what I cannot tell you (yet, anyway) is why on earth Outlook will sporadically scan the Zone Maps when opening/creating an HTML-formatted e-mail, or when entering or editing HTML-formatted text. What boggles me (and leads me to believe that this is perhaps fixable through some trick without any intervention on MS's behalf) is the work-around trick which entirely negates this behavior.
As mentioned earlier, when the user goes into the options and makes any change before clicking OK to quit, the program will entirely overlook this previous behavior and completely ignore the Zone Maps. Otherwise, upon closer inspection I have discovered that it will in fact still scan the registry even with immunization disabled, but because the Zone Maps are so limited without the Spybot immunizations (in my case, anyway), there is no noticeable slowdown.
:oops:
(Problem 2, IE7 Slowdown or Crashing)
I cannot say what this problem may be exactly, as I have fortunately never experienced it. Perhaps users should consider narrowing down the possibilities one at a time by turning certain programs on and off. Also, it would be wise to verify that any computer in question does not have any malware or viruses running on it, as these will absolutely lead to an unstable Internet Explorer. Finally, perhaps the computers in question simply are not up to spec enough, or are simply not as optimized as they could be in order to run IE7 well. There are many ways of improving a computer's performance with simple adjustments, and the steps for these can be found in many places online.
===================================================
As for the possible causes that you had mentioned: I did in fact check for those very same issues before I made my very first post, so I can tell you that at least in the case of problem 1, these are not the issues. Here is a breakdown of what I have checked for:
1) Phishing Filter has been permanently disabled and turned off for all user accounts since the initial installation of IE7. (Why would anyone surf the net and let MS track their every movement?)
2) Antivirus program entirely disabled (including having its service stopped/disabled) for the purposes of the test.
3) TeaTimer not running/installed, Bad Download Blocker disabled for purposes of the test.
4) All installed/running services audited and tested for their affect on Outlook slowdown, with no obvious source proving to be responsible.
Right now, I am attempting to further narrow down what exactly gets called for/looked at when Outlook is loaded as well as when Outlook's options are set and saved. Perhaps if I can locate a particular MS registry entry or command that is not being called or executed reliably, but is still reset by the work-around fix, I will in the least be able to make an official bug report of it to MS.
I will post again when I find out more information...
-Ronald Reagan
Sad to say, I've joined this group.
I ran Windows Updates yesterday on two machines, and BANG, when I type in an Outlook email (HTML format), it takes forever to show my characters.
I read all of these posts, and see that I can go into Tools/Options/Security... change ANYTHING... change it back, and click 'OK', and then BANG, I'm back up to speed.
I tried for hours different scenarios between SpyBot, Outlook etc. but never got it to work after a reboot.
FINALLY I just restored my computer, and did NOT run the Windows Updates, and Voila, I'm back up to speed again.
BUT I'm nervous. I did this exact thing last night, and then I uninstalled iTunes and Quicktime (I'm on an XP machine), and BANG, the slowness came back.
I'm NERVOUS that when I do any kind of program update, add, whatever, that I'll be crawling again.
MS better fix this!
There seems to be something in the MS updates done this morning (5/9/07) that triggered this behavior for those of us not previously affected.
It was caused by one of the following three updates:
Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer 7 for Windows XP (KB931768) Wednesday, May 09, 2007
Windows XP Update for Windows XP (KB930916) Wednesday, May 09, 2007
Windows XP Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool - May 2007 (KB890830)
I've run a SB S&D immunization last week sometime, and didn't have any problems at all until this morning's updates.
Who thought it was a good idea to scan a buffer against ANYTHING on every keypress!?! No wonder everything is so bloated and it takes a multi-gigahertz machine with gigs of RAM to do anything these days!
The4Bs is correct that this isn't really a Spybot S&D issue, since all Spybot really does is add a number of entries to that list,
Bitman
Can you tell me where "that list" is stored? Is it in the registry or some file. I would love to look and see what my "list" looks like.
My guess is that it's the IE update OR the 'crypto' update (I don't remember what it was literally called).
Why on earth are they checking every keystroke??? On my 1.8 ghz P4, if I type really fast, I simply do NOT see ANY characters until I stop typing... lines and lines worth! That sucks.
I actually hope a few million users experience this major slowdown so the gripe goes straight up the food-chain.
Bring back DOS !
:2thumb:
I too have joined the club! For now, the workaround that RonaldReagan posted is working for my Outlook. I suspect as the security features and program complexity continue to grow, there will be more of these undesireable "interactions" among programs that will manifest themselves in different ways. I also learned this morning that I had to go to a separate website for updates to my Office 2003 and do it manually. I installed all 6 of them but nothing resolved the issue until I followed RonaldReagan's prescription. Computers should help me be more efficient - not be another burden! Back to servicing record changers - something I understand!
... I also learned this morning that I had to go to a separate website for updates to my Office 2003 and do it manually.
If you go to the Windows Update site there is an option to add Office updates to the Windows updates. We get all of our Office updates automatically this way.
On a separate note ... are any of the folks having this typing issue using Norton Internet Security 2007? We are using it on all 3 of our computers (all 3 computers have the same typing delay problem). Has anyone tried disabling it to see if things improve? This was suggested to me at another forum but I'm away from those computers right now and haven't had a chance to try this yet.
Cheers.
New poster:
I'm not a regular Spybot user, but have used it in the past. I don't have Spybot even installed on my pc, (I use Spyware Blaster) but experienced this problem in outlook 2003 immediately after installing the latest three windoze updates released on 5/9/07.
This is not a spybot issue but another bigtime screwup by M$. I'm just wondering if I can uninstall those patches without doing more damage...
M$ needs to fix this fast.
... are any of the folks having this typing issue using Norton Internet Security 2007? We are using it on all 3 of our computers (all 3 computers have the same typing delay problem). Has anyone tried disabling it to see if things improve? This was suggested to me at another forum ...
Didn't work. No difference.
Today I discovered I couldn't type emails. Googling Outlook 2003 + slow didn't find anything and it was some time before I discovered it was only in HTML format that the problem was happening. New search and found this thread. Thanks!
There has been a rash of MS updates in the last day or so coming through progressively on all three pc's although currently I only have this problem on one. This also coincides with the fact that from yesterday sending and receiving mail seemed to take ages.
In fact I have just rechecked and the other two are still ok. They don't have either spy programs installed although it seems that might be a red herring.
Is this a cunning plan to make us move to Vista in desparation?
:oops: Sorry; double posted and can't see where "delete post" is hidden
Since this seemed to not be a Spybot issue I started another thread at the AumHa Forums (http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?t=26866) They have been VERY helpful to me in the past solving problems. Not much to report so far but it just feels good to have smart people like them on the case.
By the way, I uninstalled Spybot, rebooted and still had the same problem. Then I re-installed Spybot.
Definitely not Spybot.
By the way, I uninstalled Spybot, rebooted and still had the same problem. Then I re-installed Spybot.
Definitely not Spybot.
Hmmm...
Uninstalled Spybot again, rebooted, reset IE 7 (Tools, Internet Options, Advanced, Reset) and now Outlook works just fine.
Clearing out IE 7 "stuff" seems to do it.
But why does Outlook work fine just by making any kind of change in the options (with Spybot still installed and immunization on), until it is shutdown and restarted?
Questions, questions ...
There seems to be something in the MS updates done this morning (5/9/07) that triggered this behavior for those of us not previously affected.
It was caused by one of the following three updates:
Cumulative Security Update for Internet Explorer 7 for Windows XP (KB931768) Wednesday, May 09, 2007
Windows XP Update for Windows XP (KB930916) Wednesday, May 09, 2007
Windows XP Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool - May 2007 (KB890830)
Sample of issues reported:
Windows XP General (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone/newsgroups/reader.mspx?dg=microsoft.public.windowsxp.general&tid=f76abffb-a815-4572-80fa-a68dde76fc1b&lang=en&cr=US&p=1)
Google Groups. microsoft . public . windowsupdate (http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.windowsupdate/topics?lnk=rgh)
KB931768 causes IE7 failure w/ navcancl & ieframe.dll &temp solut (http://www.tabletquestions.com/internet-explorer/112976-kb931768-causes-ie7-failure-w-navcancl-ieframe-dll-temp-soluti.html)
Windows Update killed IE7! navcancl & ieframe.dll error (http://www.tabletquestions.com/internet-explorer/112882-windows-update-killed-ie7-navcancl-ieframe-dll-error.html)
KB931768 'navcancl' error crippling IE7 for some Vista users (http://itsvista.com/2007/05/kb931768-navcancl-error-crippling-ie7-for-some-vista-users/)
Problem after installing IE7 update(KB931768) (http://thevistaforums.com/index.php?showtopic=13812)
You receive an access violation error when you try to install an update from Windows Update or from Microsoft Update after you applyhotfix package KB916089 (http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=927891)
3 pc's; all XP SP2; all on autoupdate for XP
2 unaffected don't have Spybot
1 which is grinding to a halt in Outlook has.
Not scientific but.......
I will try installing Spybot on one of the others.
I'm certain the core problem lies just with MS. BUT I do have one computer that does NOT (has not ever) had SpyBot loaded on it, and it took the updates and does emails just fine. So I'm thinking it's still possible that once SpyBot is installed...?
It's funny... the Windows update warning usually says something like "Somebody could take your computer over...". I'm almost tempted to let them. After 1 day of sending emails, they'd popup a message to me and say 'OMG you poor bastard. I took over your computer but it ain't worth it. You can have it back. I'll never bother you again. I'll be praying for you...'
Have to find some humor in this somewhere...
See this (http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?p=151711#151711) post from the good people at AumHa for a great summary of the issue.
Yes, I will also bring this to Team Spybot's attention, thanks.
This issue of delayed typing in a new Outlook 2000 email has been bugging several users (~5 out of 30) at my firm for the last day and a half. None have current Spybot immunizations. Several reported the problem improved or went away. One user continued to have significant delays. After switching her OL to use MS Word as the email editor, the problem appeared to go away.
-mastman
mmeltser
2007-05-12, 02:18
After this last Windows Update 2 days ago, I started experiencing the issue with slow typing in Outlook and slow performance in opening HTML e-mails in general. Similar to what I did about a month ago on my in-laws computer, removing the immunization from Spybot restored the performance in Outlook.
I would like to keep the immunization, but would prefer to not reduce my security level in Outlook and feel it is much more likely for Spybot to come out with a fix for what is likely a IE7 problem than for Microsoft to do it.
Dell E510 Dual core 3.0 GHz
1 GB RAM
Windows XP Media Edition SP2
IE7
McAfee AntiVirus and Firewall
Let me know what else you'd need to know. It would be nice to get this nailed down.
Rgds/Mark M.
The real problem turns out to be an issue with one of the new security features in Internet Explorer 7 and older versions of Outlook (2003 or earlier) which used Internet Explorer for editing HTML email. The problems apparently don't exist in Outlook 2007 since it uses a different HTML editor. It's also claimed that Vista isn't affected, though I heard no explanation or testing of why this might be true.
Apparently using Word for HTML email or switching to text only will work around the problem, but the only currently known workarounds using IE 7 are complex and reduce security as a side effect.
I won't go into further detail here, since these aren't my own discoveries and I haven't examined them to the depth required to explain them more completely anyway. The only true 'fix' would require [possibly extensive] changes by Microsoft to the operation of at least IE 7 and probably also older versions of Outlook.
The point for this thread is that Spybot S&D and even its Immunizations are NOT the cause, they simply aggravate and expose the situation. The only 'fix' with Spybot would be to remove the Restricted Zone Immunization entries, which is really just a workaround as it removes the items contributing to the overhead, not the root cause.
As I stated earlier, any true 'fix' would need to come for Microsoft and their position has always been that Restricted Sites were never intended to have thousands of automatically added entries, but rather a handful of manual entries made by the user over time. In other words, I wouldn't hold my breath and would probably look at one of the workarounds already mentioned to solve the immediate problem.
Bitman
RonaldReagan
2007-05-12, 12:35
My Fellow Americans, (I just felt like using it this one time!)
So as I've been reading through the various posts from all of the readers, I've noticed that some people may not know exactly what's causing this. Obviously, the thread is getting a little deep, so naturally many people may be losing the facts in the process because they're getting buried under a bunch of other helpful posts. So to make things easier, I just wanted to sum up the major issues, and to see if I couldn’t clear some ideas up in the process.
Okay, here goes... :eek:
=========================================================
(The Problem)
When typing or accessing HTML-formatted text in Outlook 2003 (possibly other versions of Outlook as well), there is a great slowdown with either typing or opening an e-mail.
(The Cause)
This problem is ultimately triggered by a combination of factors. Although there have been many potential causes listed for this problem, the root causes are as follow:
Outlook 2003
Internet Explorer 7
Spybot 1.4 + Immunizations (Not At Fault, But Does Add To The Delay)
(The Summary)
By running Spybot Immunizations, Spybot is placing several thousand entries into a user's registry in order to help specify which websites Internet Explorer should not under any circumstances open or run. These are known as "bad domains," and they are actually a very handy way of enhancing security in Internet Explorer.
The main problem is that inexplicably, Outlook will scan this entire list of "bad domains" each time that it has to access an HTML-formatted e-mail or any of its text. For example: If you start Outlook and open an HTML-formatted e-mail, you may notice a delay. Conversely, if you create a new e-mail and begin to type, you may notice a gradual typing delay that will eventually build into a complete stall with no text appearing until you stop typing.
The reason for this awkward behavior is because Outlook is instructing your CPU to scan each and every single entry listed as a "bad domain," which when combined with the 15,000+ (at present) entries that are also added by Spybot in addition to anything that may already be there, causes a tremendous slowdown.
(The Solution)
Officially, there is none yet. However, there are several work-around solutions. These are:
1) Each time Outlook is started, go to Tools/Options (in your menu bar), click on the Security tab, and then click OK to exit.
- This is a revised solution to the one I originally proposed, and after doing more tests I noticed that no change/revert was needed under the Security tab, only an OK click. -
2) Don't use HTML formatting.
- By disabling HTML formatting in your Outlook Mail Format options you circumvent the problem entirely, as all e-mails (not matter what their original format) are presented in either RTF or plain text mode. Although in theory this is a safer way of viewing e-mails, many people (myself included) do not wish to use this format setting. -
3) Using Spybot, go to Immunize, and click the "Undo" arrow in between the "Check Again" magnifying glass icon and the "Help" icon.
- Doing this will instruct Spybot to remove all of the entries that it had previously entered into your "bad domains" list, and thus greatly improving (if not entirely) solving your slowdown. *It is important to know that by doing this, the real nature of the problem is not resolved, in addition to this fix turning off what would otherwise be a very strong security feature offered by Spybot. This can of course be re-enabled at anytime by going to Immunize and by clicking the green cross icon labeled "Immunize." -
(The Questions)
Why does resetting my Internet Explorer fix this problem?
- Resetting Internet Explorer, amongst other things, clears all of the entries listed as "bad domains" in the registry. Doing this removes the enlarged list that is ultimately scanned by the CPU when reviewing HTML-formatted text or e-mails. This problem will absolutely return as soon as any substantial entries are replaced in this section of the registry, i.e. when running a Spybot Immunization. -
Where are the "bad domains" stored?
- To answer a previous reader's post, this list of "bad domains" can be viewed manually with the registry editor under:
"HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Internet Settings\ZoneMap\Domains"
This list includes any domains that have been added by default, manually by the user, and by any other program (such as Spybot).
*Please be advised the editing the registry manually or accidentally deleting important keys/entries could result in serious system software damage. Do not view or edit the registry unless you are confident in your abilities. -
Are Windows Updates to blame?
- Possibly, although not in my case. Although this may be different for other users, I can personally comment and say that I do not believe this to be the result of a Windows Update. I myself do not run an Automatic Update (permanently disabled for all user accounts), and I do not visit the Microsoft Windows Update website unless I am going there to manually download a hotfix or new software. In this case, I did not have any hotfixes or anything else of that nature installed, and my computer began exhibiting the typing delay exclusively and immediately following my upgrade to Internet Explorer 7. Obviously, with each Spybot Immunization update that I performed, my problem continued to get worse, as my CPU progressively had to run through more and more entries in the "bad domains." I have a very well-powered machine that is relatively new (9 months old), and in my case I can attest to not having many of the components associated with Windows Updates (such as Windows Defender) installed on my computer. -
Will a Service Pack or Windows Update to either my Windows or my Office 2003 fix the delay?
- At present, no. No Service Pack or individual update yet exists that addresses this problem. -
Does my Anti-Virus program (such as Norton's or McAfee) cause this problem?
- Fortunately, it does not. This problem is not in any way caused by the presence of an Internet Security or Anti-Virus program. This has been verified by me, as well as by many other competent users. -
=========================================================
Well folks, there you have it. A nice and complete summary for anyone who may be visiting this thread for the first time. If I neglected to mention any other important facts, please feel free to tack them on as replies. Of course, I will also post again should I have any more answers or input to give.
I can only hope that my continuing research turns up more answers. Of course, judging by the explosive progress of this thread, it is likely that Microsoft will jump on this before I or anyone else ever figures out what's really wrong. Or at least I hope that they would! Anyway, I have filed a bug report with Microsoft detailing my findings, so hopefully they will be able to act upon it and many other similar ones that I'm sure they have also received.
Until this happens, my only course of action is to say, "Mr. Microsoft, please tear down this delay!" :laugh:
My Best,
-Ronald Reagan
RonaldReagan,
Have you tried switching your Outlook 2003 to use Word as its email composer?
Since the core problem here is apparently a change in the handling of Security Zones between Internet Explorer 7 and earlier versions of IE, removing IE from the equation appears to be the simplest workaround.
Actually, the simplest way to fix it is to upgrade to Outlook 2007, since that inherently uses Word 2007 for email composition, but that would entail a cost. Since you can get exactly the same effect by simply choosing your current version of Word (2003 or earlier) for email composition, you avoid the cost but workaround the problem.
Eventually this may get fixed with changes to Outlook 2003 and possibly IE 7 itself if that wouldn't reduce security. However, I wouldn't expect this to be carried back to older versions of Outlook which are no longer in mainstream support, so it's likely that the workarounds will be the only recourse for anyone with older versions of Office than 2003.
Bitman
As a followup, I just discovered that the reason why Outlook 2003 is affected is quite clear, based on the following exceprt from Office 2003 Security Enhancements (http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/office/office2003/deploy/secdesn.mspx):
Restricted Sites Setting - In Outlook 2003, the default security zone setting is Restricted Sites (rather than Internet); active scripting within restricted sites is also disabled by default. The Restricted Sites security zone disables most automatic scripting and prevents ActiveX controls from opening without permission. These new security features help protect users from many viruses that are spread by means of scripting. For more information on Restricted Sites and Internet zones, see the Microsoft Knowledge Base article (Q174360), How to Use Security Zones in Internet Explorer (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/q174360/).
So the problem was created by the combination of Outlook 2003 operating in the Restricted Sites zone, which implies it will be affected by entries within that zone and the fact that zone handling has changed in Internet Explorer 7. How to fix this issue without reducing the level of security will be the challenge.
The change to using Word for email composition with Outlook 2007 is likely part of the larger security initiative at Microsoft, since this compartmentalizes the security concerns for Outlook messaging within the Office development group, rather than including Internet Explorer dependancies that have existed in the past. This decouples the Office application suite from both IE 7 and to some extent even the operating system itself, since past versions were deeply entwined in both.
Bitman
I just wanted to sum up the major issues ...Excellent! Thanks.
I have filed a bug report with Microsoft
Cool.
Thanks for your efforts. Undoubtedly many will benefit from your efforts.
goldengate
2007-05-12, 22:04
So based on Bitman's post, I went into TOOLS, OPTIONS, MAIL FORMAT then clicked on using Word to edit and read emails...voila...the delay seems to be gone.
Of course we've thought it was fixed before....
Reading back through the more recent posts I also see that many are focused on Internet Explorer 7 as the 'problem' here.
While it's true that a change in the design of security zones within IE 7 has helped contribute to the issue, the real problem lies in the dependancy of Outlook 2003 on IE 7 for HTML rendering. In attempting to protect Outlook from future exploits of HTML within email messages, this made Outlook dependant upon portions of the Internet Explorer [6 or 7] security zones and susceptible to future changes in their handling.
So the fault here lies with the Office 2003 development group who made these short sighted decisions in an attempt to buffer themselves from potential future HTML rendering exploits. Apparently they realized this flaw while developing Office 2007 and chose to remove this dependancy by using Word [2007] for HTML rendering, placing the responsibility and control for security and other concerns back in their own hands.
Other components of the operating system have often been blamed for the faults of Office/Outlook in the past, including problems with oversided PST files and other co-dependant security issues. This was really the result of too many cross dependancies between portions of Office and other parts of the OS, including Internet Explorer. I'm glad to see that with Office 2007 they seem to have taken the direction of removing these dependancies.
Bitman
Currently out of three pc's all have Outlook 2003 IE7 and XP SP2:
One has spybot; displays Outllook problem.
The other two don't have spybot and show no problem.
So, I installed spybot on one of these and ran immunisation. No change - still ok. I appreciate that spybot may only contribute to the problem by adding to the number of restriced sites but I would have thought that on pc#2 it would have had some effect. Zilch!
If you work in rtf then the problem is avoided until you try to reply to an email which uses html.
Has anyone tried the regedit suggestions mentioned earlier (post 31)? Does the "one liner" work?
Raincheck!
Looked closely at the uneffected pc and realised (because I don't actually use this one for emails) that the default setting was to use Word! Unticked that box! Voila! B*gge*ed! Bet I could almost get the email sent before the text appeared.
Removing immunisation didn't make any difference.
Naive question: what is the problem with leaving the Word box ticked? My normal way of using Outlook is not to use Word so I don't know what effect this has either obvious to the user or in underlying security issues.
We've had a similar problem with one of our applications that reuses the MSHTML control. The problem was reported by some users who are using Spybot with immunisation.
I'd be interested to hear if the fix we've found helps fix Outlook as well. The solution we have at the moment is to add an extra entry into the Windows Registry.
In the registry key:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Main\FeatureControl\FEATURE_MIME_SNIFFING
Add a new DWORD value called "outlook.exe" and set this to 1.
RonaldReagan
2007-05-15, 01:15
Hello Again Everyone!
Yes, I actually have been aware that using Word would avoid the problem all together for some time now. I actually was going to amend fix number 2 in my previous post to include this instruction, but when I tried to post the text, the limit on editing a post had already expired.
I personally do not like this fix, as using Word to edit e-mails is rather inefficient, as its core has to be opened separately from Outlook's and thus results in much more memory being taken up. Regardless, it is a valid work-around, and there are no other side effects other than having a much more detailed text editing environment. :red:
As for Office 2007...
For me, that's just not going to happen for the time being. As I may have mentioned earlier, I'm not one who enjoys upgrading software just because. I prefer to pick a software set that I am comfortable with, and then to use it for a predetermined amount of time until I really do see a need to upgrade. Knowing how Microsoft does it, Outlook 2007 will likely offer even less functionality while taking even more system resources than its predecessor with all sorts of unnecessary bells and whistles.
-Ronald Reagan
RonaldReagan
2007-05-15, 02:00
We've had a similar problem with one of our applications that reuses the MSHTML control. The problem was reported by some users who are using Spybot with immunisation.
I'd be interested to hear if the fix we've found helps fix Outlook as well. The solution we have at the moment is to add an extra entry into the Windows Registry.
In the registry key:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Main\FeatureControl\FEATURE_MIME_SNIFFING
Add a new DWORD value called "outlook.exe" and set this to 1.
Hey Guys, I think we're onto a partial fix here... :laugh:
Everyone give a big round of applause for ABurt, as this is a really solid lead!
This is actually something that I was investigating through my own research, and then I spotted this post outlining very similar steps. I went ahead and applied this fix to my registry and indeed it does work!
However...
Although the fix works, it's not complete. The very first HTML-formatted e-mail that you open or create will still scan your "bad domains," but all other e-mails that are opened/created after this will operate flawlessly. Furthermore, your typing will be back to normal, and at no point will it scan the "bad domains."
To apply this fix, follow the instructions quoted above, or copy and paste the following text into a text file and then save it out with the extension ".REG" Once saved, double click on the file and then click OK at the prompt to automatically add its contents to your registry.
========================================================
Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Main\FeatureControl\FEATURE_MIME_SNIFFING]
"outlook.exe"=dword:00000001
========================================================
*Warning, do not apply this fix unless you are comfortable with editing your registry, and if you are certain that this issue/fix applies to you.
I still need to check to see if there are any other unwanted side-effects or any other issues with this fix, but so far it looks solid. I will continue to do more research to see if we can make it even more complete. Until then, good luck!
-Ronald Reagan
I personally do not like this fix, as using Word to edit e-mails is rather inefficient, as its core has to be opened separately from Outlook's and thus results in much more memory being taken up. Regardless, it is a valid work-around, and there are no other side effects other than having a much more detailed text editing environment. :red:
Actually, your reasoning here is why some in the security community don't like this workaround either, since bringing the codebase of Word into the operation of your messaging system also has the potential to bring any vulnerabilities along with it. Possibly a much worse situation than either resources or the initial problem itself.
However, it is simply a workaround, not a solution and as such will inherently have limitations.
As for Office 2007...
For me, that's just not going to happen for the time being. As I may have mentioned earlier, I'm not one who enjoys upgrading software just because. I prefer to pick a software set that I am comfortable with, and then to use it for a predetermined amount of time until I really do see a need to upgrade. Knowing how Microsoft does it, Outlook 2007 will likely offer even less functionality while taking even more system resources than its predecessor with all sorts of unnecessary bells and whistles.
Again, I understand what you're saying and the economic realities that will affect this decision for many. but you have misunderstood a fundamental fact. What you stated could quite effectively describe the incremental upgrades from Office 2000 to XP (2002) and then to 2003.
However, the changes in Office 2007 are much more radical, especially as they relate to security, so this is one upgrade that is worth having. It really only makes sense though to include the upgrade to the Vista OS, since it's really when these occur together that you truly strengthen the security of the entire system.
Performing these upgrades in a piecemeal fashion will only provide patchwork improvements in security, as well as leaving any other applications known to contain vulnerabilities in earlier versions. This is a common mistake made by those with no security training, believing that upgrading just the OS will protect them or that patching just the OS or Office removes all vulnerabilities. At this point in time, even obscure applications have come under attack, especially if they have an association to financial or other high interest areas often focused around financial gain.
Bitman
RonaldReagan
2007-05-15, 12:18
Hello Bitman,
Quite frankly, I don't understand the point of your last post.
I think that any discourse regarding the benefits of software upgrades, and really, anything else of that sort should best be saved for another place. This message board is here to help unify and inform users of certain software configurations, Office 2003 in particular, who are currently experiencing a slowdown with their HTML-formatted e-mails.
Any other discussion is irrelevant, and unnecessary.
Perhaps you work for Microsoft, or even get a commission from them based on aggregate sales of Office 2007? Regardless, I am honestly not interested in your opinions.
I am here to help share what I have learned with other users in the hopes of coming to a better understanding of what this problem is. I am not here to have my donated work/time dissected by a rambling pseudo-professional. Unless you have something noteworthy to contribute, please refrain from posting replies; at least to my posts. You are only cluttering the thread and making it harder for people to actually find the information that would otherwise benefit them.
Thank You,
-Ronald Reagan
RonaldReagan.
Please refrain from flaming our Advisors or any user here, your post was reported by two other members. :sad:
Bitman's input is perfectly reasonable, informative, unbiased and welcome.
Regards.
This message board is here to help unify and inform users of certain software configurations, Office 2003 in particular, who are currently experiencing a slowdown with their HTML-formatted e-mails.
Any other discussion is irrelevant, and unnecessary.
The purpose of these forums is for Spybot-Search & Destroy support, not Outlook. ;)
At this point a more appropriate forum would be one that supports Office/Outlook, which is the real cause of this issue.
Apprantly Spybot-S&D was just one of the contributors, for some people, and not the core problem.
To that end:
A synopsis by Jim Eshelman at AumHa:
http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?p=151711#151711
Public NewsGroups for Outlook:
http://www.microsoft.com/office/community/en-us/default.mspx?dg=microsoft.public.outlook.general&lang=en&cr=US
There are several threads already:
http://www.microsoft.com/office/community/en-us/default.mspx?query=Restricted+Sites&dg=microsoft.public.outlook.general&cat=en-us-office-outlook&lang=en&cr=US&pt=50663fd1-dbad-4705-b915-e4cf683e70fe&catlist=&dglist=&ptlist=&exp=&sloc=en-us
Best wishes everyone. :)
RonaldReagan
2007-05-16, 05:14
Dear Tashi,
Apparently you may have missed several of the great posts made by myself and by many other users that have already clearly established that Spybot is in fact not the cause of this problem. Obviously, the problem is with Zonemap handling in Outlook, and of course Spybot is a contributor due to its Immunization feature. I think you would be doing this message board a great service is you would review its posts a bit more thoroughly before attempting to question them.
I have done a tremendous job of isolating the causes of this problem and sharing them with the rest of this message board. I do not appreciate your attempt to negate everything that I have worked for by reiterating facts that have already been established. Perhaps if you were more attentive and thorough, this would not be an issue.
Furthermore, I do not appreciate your attempt to regulate my opinions, as what I posted was both fair and necessary. Your lack of professionalism, the pusillanimous nature of some of your posters (although not all, I am sure), and your inability to tolerate my candor are suspect and infuriating. As such, I will immediately resign my account with the Spybot forums, and I will leave the responsibility of dissecting and solving this issue to your team. Seeing as how you have made absolutely no progress until this thread was formed, I expect no results.
The readers of this thread may thank you for prolonging this problem, Tashi.
-Ronald Reagan
< SNIP >
Obviously, the problem is with Zonemap handling in Outlook,
< SNIP >
No it isn't, it's an issue with changes to the Security operation of Internet Explorer 7, which is being called for HTML rendering by Outlook.
Your summary simply parallels the much more thorough work being done by those posting in the AumHa thread, including the much more complete summary to be found there. I recommend that those wishing to understand the real problem review that thread, especially Jim Eshelman's post which was also referenced earlier in this thread by member The4Bs.
http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?p=151711#151711
As such, I will immediately resign my account with the Spybot forums, and I will leave the responsibility of dissecting and solving this issue to your team. Seeing as how you have made absolutely no progress until this thread was formed, I expect no results.
Thanks, since Spybot Search & Destroy has absolutely nothing to do with the core problem, I'd say that work has been completed. Since this thread was the first mention of the problem here, it would have been difficult to make any progress before anyone was notified of its existence.
The readers of this thread may thank you for prolonging this problem,
Since Spybot S&D has nothing to do with the real problem, it also can't fix it. This is entirely an issue for Microsoft, since the real problem is between two of its products and its own definition of a portion of the registry. Thus the fix must be made within their code, if they are interested in fixing it at all.
Personally, I'd choose one of the workarounds mentioned above and forget about it until a fix is made available. It's just not that big a deal.
Bitman
This topic is closed, thanks everyone.